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The ultimate Israel - Palestine Thread (it's all here) (pg. 154)
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| shaolin_Z |
| quote: | Originally posted by ogvh5150
Let me ask this:
If Palestinians were offered a trade of an equal amount of land in any part of the world would this be alright?
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You can't be serious right? Would you be ok with being forcibly removed from the land where your people have lived for centuries? Don't forget the cultural and religious significance of the land eighter. |
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| shaolin_Z |
Apparently this doesn't apply to Palestinians:
| quote: | | "We are going to fight like any other person would fight when being uprooted from their home," Nadia Matar told the Associated Press. |
Taken from:
| quote: |
Israel settlers clash with troops
More than 150 Jewish settlers have clashed with Israeli forces sent to demolish an illegal West Bank outpost.
Five activists were arrested after they threw paint at a bulldozer trying to demolish the foundations of the outpost near Neve Daniel.
The Israeli troops used tear gas to disperse the protestors before returning to the demolition.
The US-brokered "roadmap" peace plan demands Israel uproot all West Bank outposts built since March 2001.
Under international law, all settlement building in Gaza and the West Bank, including East Jerusalem is considered illegal, though Israel disputes this.
'Too nice'
One settler said activists had come from miles around to protest against the demolition of the outpost close to the Gush Etzion settlement bloc.
"We are going to fight like any other person would fight when being uprooted from their home," Nadia Matar told the Associated Press.
"We have reached the stage where our own government has turned into a government that wants to uproot Jews from their homeland. We were much too nice in Gaza."
Elsewhere in the West Bank, Israeli troops were pelted with eggs in the last few days ahead of the eviction of eight Jewish settler families squatting in Palestinian-owned buildings in the centre of Hebron.
Israel's High Court ruled that they could not prove they owned the properties and ordered the settlers to leave by 15 January. |
Source: BBC |
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| shaolin_Z |
| quote: |
Israel: Gaza Power Cut Would Violate Laws of War
Militant Attacks Cannot Justify Unlawful Collective Punishment
(Jerusalem, December 23, 2005) – A reported proposal by Israeli government officials to cut the Gaza Strip’s electricity supply in retaliation for Palestinian militant groups’ rocket attacks on Israel would constitute unlawful collective punishment of Gaza's civilian population, Human Rights Watch said today.
A report on Wednesday in the Israeli newspaper Ha'aretz said top Israeli government officials discussed plans to cut electricity to the Gaza Strip if Palestinian militant groups continue to fire Qassam rockets into Israel.
Human Rights Watch condemns the use of Qassam rockets, which are indiscriminate weapons often fired into Israeli civilian areas in violation of international humanitarian law, and urges militant groups to stop their attacks. But, in turn, any measures that Israel takes to protect its citizens from these attacks must be consistent with its obligations under international humanitarian law.
Cutting electricity to the entire population of Gaza violates a basic principle of international humanitarian law, which restricts a government that has effective control over a territory from attacking or withholding objects essential to the survival of the civilian population. Such an act would also violate Israel's duty as an occupying power to safeguard the health and welfare of the occupied population.
The online edition of Israel’s largest-circulation daily, Yediot Ahronot, reported that senior army officers in Israel’s Southern Command, responsible for air and land operations in and around northern Gaza, expressed strong opposition to the plan while meeting with Israeli Defense Minister Shaul Mofaz to discuss possible responses to the Qassam rockets.
"Cutting the electricity supply of an already impoverished population would have disastrous humanitarian consequences," said Sarah Leah Whitson, Middle East and North Africa director at Human Rights Watch. "A power cut would create severe hardships by interrupting government services, forcing businesses and factories to close, causing food and medicine to spoil, and disrupting the work of hospitals."
Israel withdrew its military forces and settlers from the Gaza Strip in August and September. Nonetheless, Israel continues to hold responsibility for ensuring the well-being of Gaza's population for as long as, and to the extent that, it retains effective control over the area. Israel still exercises full control over Gaza's airspace, sea space and land borders with Israel as well as its electricity, water, sewage and telecommunications networks and population registry. Under the disengagement plan, Israel reserves the right to reenter Gaza militarily at any time.
Israel has stated that it may take such measures to punish Gaza's civilian population for support of the militant groups that carry out rocket and suicide bombing attacks. Ha'aretz reported that during a government debate on cutting electricity to Gaza, "the prevailing view was that Palestinian public opinion could pressure the terrorist organizations to restrain their attacks if many Palestinians came to feel that the price they were paying for such attacks was too high.”
Cutting electricity to Gaza would amount to collective punishment, which is expressly forbidden under international humanitarian law. According to this principle, a person cannot be punished for a crime that they have not personally committed. The International Committee of the Red Cross has clarified in its authoritative commentary of Article 33 of the Fourth Geneva Convention that "[t]he concept of collective punishment must be understood in the broadest sense: it covers not only legal sentences but sanctions and harassment of any sort..."
"It’s disturbing that the Israeli government would seriously consider such a blatant disregard of its legal obligations, given the cruel consequences of such a measure on Palestinian civilians," said Whitson.
This is not the first time since its withdrawal from the Gaza Strip that Israel has sought to punish Gaza's population collectively for the actions of militant groups. For example, from September 24 to November 12, Israel barred all Palestinian workers from Gaza from entering Israel following Palestinian rocket attacks that injured six Israelis. In December, Israel barred Palestinian workers in Gaza (and the West Bank) from entering Israel for six days after a Palestinian suicide bomber from the northern West Bank killed five Israelis in Netanya.
During these periods, more than 5,000 Palestinian workers with valid permits to enter Israel were unable to reach their jobs. The impact of lost days of work is particularly serious in Gaza, where the poverty rate continues to climb. According to the United Nations Office for the Coordination of Humanitarian Affairs, 68 per cent of the population in Gaza lives below the poverty line. |
Source: Human Rights Watch |
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| ogvh5150 |
| quote: | Originally posted by ogvh5150
Let me ask this:
If Palestinians were offered a trade of an equal amount of land in any part of the world would this be alright? |
| quote: | Originally posted by shaolin_Z
You can't be serious right? Would you be ok with being forcibly removed from the land where your people have lived for centuries? Don't forget the cultural and religious significance of the land eighter. |
Why quote what you want me to quote. Leave it in full next time and come up with a good answer:
| quote: | Originally posted by ogvh5150
Let me ask this:
If Palestinians were offered a trade of an equal amount of land in any part of the world would this be alright?
I am not discounting the bloodshed on any ones part whether they be Palestinian or Israeli before the post whores flame me.
Please I ask that anyone to make statements factual and to the point. I don't want to see this he said, she said or they did this and that nonsense as that will get nowhere.
Yoepus, Cyrus, hardcore trancer, shaolin_z, MisterOpus, smokeape and others are welcomed to answer. |
Apparently you missed the part where I say I didn't want to hear "he said, she said" arguments.
If they stole the land before they will steal it some more.
Question is if they are gonna swipe the land there should be something in return somewhere on the planet.
Unless you want them to have the land for free. |
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| shaolin_Z |
| quote: | Originally posted by ogvh5150
Why quote what you want me to quote. Leave it in full next time and come up with a good answer: |
Ok. I don't see what wrong with my answer.
| quote: | Originally posted by ogvh5150
Apparently you missed the part where I say I didn't want to hear "he said, she said" arguments. |
But I didn't. :conf: I just gave you the facts.
| quote: | Originally posted by ogvh5150
If they stole the land before they will steal it some more.
Question is if they are gonna swipe the land there should be something in return somewhere on the planet.
Unless you want them to have the land for free. |
:conf: Let me see if I interpreted this right: Since they (zionists) have already stolen land to being with and they continue to do so, the Palestinians should just accept it for land elsewhere? |
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| ogvh5150 |
| Now you're using that grey matter. |
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| shaolin_Z |
| quote: | Originally posted by ogvh5150
Now you're using that grey matter. |
I think the chances of a proposal like that being accepted are very slim. |
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| emc^2 |
To all those who wish Sharon would die. Just remember: "The devil you know..." . The people standing in the wings, ready to take his place will not be as moderate. Actually, I'm quite ready for another hard liner to take the Israeli office. Israel has become soft under Sharon and has not gained a yota of security over withdrawal plan. If anything, it made Israel even more vulnerable.
So, the next person to take Sharon's office will hopefully clean the house. And send few jet fighters to Iran - to take care of some newly created business.
Of course, this is all just a dream. For now...
Any day when Cyrus Shtink can quote his arabic news sources about the "zionist attacks" is a good day in my book. |
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| Cyrus King |
| quote: | Originally posted by emc^2
To all those who wish Sharon would die. Just remember: "The devil you know..." . The people standing in the wings, ready to take his place will not be as moderate. Actually, I'm quite ready for another hard liner to take the Israeli office. Israel has become soft under Sharon and has not gained a yota of security over withdrawal plan. If anything, it made Israel even more vulnerable.
So, the next person to take Sharon's office will hopefully clean the house. And send few jet fighters to Iran - to take care of some newly created business.
Of course, this is all just a dream. For now...
Any day when Cyrus Shtink can quote his arabic news sources about the "zionist attacks" is a good day in my book. |
i didnt know Yahoo news was an arabic propaganda machine:rolleyes: |
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| shaolin_Z |
How?
| quote: |
Abbas vows to honour peace deals
Palestinian leader Mahmoud Abbas has vowed to honour peace agreements with Israel, while urging foreign donors to continue giving aid to the territories.
Speaking during a visit to Ramallah by German Chancellor Angela Merkel, Mr Abbas said he would carry on pursuing peace with the Jewish state.
The visit follows last week's election win by Islamic militant group Hamas.
The EU and US pledged to stop funding the Palestinians if Hamas fails to renounce violence or recognise Israel.
European foreign ministers are currently meeting in Brussels to decide whether to halt aid.
EU member states donated about $600m (£341m) to the Palestinians in 2005.
Vital work
At a news conference after meeting Ms Merkel, Mr Abbas said it was vital that the work of the Palestinian Authority should be able to carry on as normal.
"I stressed the importance of the continuation of financial and other types of support by the donor countries, in order that the institutions continue to function and the plan to build our independent Palestinian state is not disrupted or derailed," he said, referring to his conversation with the German chancellor.
He reiterated his commitment to the peace process "through negotiations and according to international legitimacy".
Ms Merkel said support for the authority was possible if the EU's conditions were met.
The Palestinian leader also denied suggestions that he would resign, and said he would meet Hamas leaders to form a new government within the next two weeks. |
Source: BBC |
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| shaolin_Z |
| quote: | Gaza EU offices raided by gunmen
Masked gunmen in Gaza have briefly stormed the local office of the EU.
They demanded an apology from Denmark and Norway over the publication of cartoons of the Prophet Muhammad that have offended Muslims.
One of the gunmen said citizens of both countries should not enter Gaza until the apology is made.
The cartoons first appeared in September in the Danish newspaper Jyllands-Posten and were later reprinted in a Norwegian paper.
| quote: |
THE ROW SO FAR
29 January: Libya says it will close its embassy in Denmark
28 January: Danish company Arla places advertisements in Mid-East newspapers trying to stop a boycott
26 January: Saudi Arabia recalls its ambassador
20 January: Ambassadors in Denmark of 10 Muslim countries complain to the Danish PM |
Some of the cartoons depict Muhammad as a terrorist. One image depicts the prophet wearing a turban shaped as a bomb with a burning fuse.
Islam bans any depiction of Muhammad or Allah, in case they lead to idolatry.
The cartoons have sparked protests, flag burning and calls for boycotts of Danish products across the Islamic world.
On Monday, about 15 gunmen burst into the EU office in Gaza City, and withdrew about 30 minutes later. No shots were fired, and there were no reports of injuries.
The al-Aqsa Martyrs' Brigades said they carried out the raid.
Danish regret
Copenhagen has expressed regret for the furore over the cartoons, but refused to get involved, citing freedom of expression. "The government can in no way influence the media," Prime Minister Anders Fogh Rasmussen said on Sunday.
"And the Danish government and the Danish nation as such cannot be held responsible for what is published in independent media," he added.
The newspaper that published the cartoons, Jyllands-Posten, has said earlier it published the drawings to test the boundaries of expression about Islam.
Its editorial on Sunday said it did not mean to insult Islam.
"We at Jyllands-Posten feel regret because the issue has reached this level and we reiterate that we did not mean to insult anybody," it said. "We believe, like the rest of Danish society, in the respect of freedom of religion." |
Source: BBC |
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| shaolin_Z |
| quote: |
British Inquiry Rules Israeli Soldier Deliberately Shot Peace Activist
In Britain, an official inquiry into the Gaza shooting death of British peace activist Tom Hurndall has ruled he was deliberately targeted by an Israeli soldier. Coroner Andrew Reid said he would ask the attorney general to look into prosecuting the soldier's commanders. The Israeli government boycotted the entire proceedings. Hurndall was shot in April 2003 as he tried to protect Palestinian children from Israeli tanks. He was in a coma for nine months before dying in a London hospital. |
Source: Democracy Now |
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